33
 5,671

 9/11 = Koran burning day

This story makes me upset beyond all description. The pastor responsible for this disgusts me. The fact that he has been told, from numerous sources, that going through with this WILL lead to the death of and attack on military service men and women, yet he is proceeding, is unfathomable.

Burning a religion's holy book is a hate crime. I don't understand how he (and his congregation) are going on with this.

From the Globe&Mail:

Quote:
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 9 Sep 2010 2:14 PM
 26 Jun 2009
 Montreal
Malkynn
Addict
4,839
Boyfriend and I lost it when we read this.

There was a lot of screaming...not with any real purpose, we just needed to scream and yell in pure anger and frustration.

I fu(king hate this.

I HATE IT.

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 9 Sep 2010 2:22 PM
 13 Aug 2002
 Toronto
FriendsFirst
Queen of the Forum
28,628
Head so far up his @ss he can see sunlight *grumble* (the yahoo who thought this would be a good idea... not MacKay... this time, anyway wink )

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 9 Sep 2010 2:23 PM
 12 May 2008
 Wisconsin, USA
ruby_wi
Raving Lunatic
14,221
I am beyond pissed about it too. It is a very small congregation of like 12 people or something. The Pastor just said that he MAY reconsider if he gets a call from President Obama himself. Give me a break.

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 9 Sep 2010 2:24 PM
 1 Jan 2010
vlahopg
Unregistered
0
Malyknn - I blame Mulroney? is that your ticker or do you blame him for the actions of someone in the US? sorry i am confused.

this whole matter is so distressing to me. I think it is awful and intolerant and is a powder keg waiting to explode.

he would lose his chit if someone burned a bible. This is a holy book to people of that faith. I wouldnt' do that to a Torah, to a Koran or any other item of religious significance to someone (sorry can't think of other books)..

not a fan of bookburning in any capacity and this is just incindiary and hateful. I can't stand when people dress their hate up in "religion" and abuse others with it.

What does he think is going to happen? remember the dutch cartoonist? extremists dont' really need a big excuse to go off like a rocket and this is a BIG excuse

i have been praying that they see reason and don't do this.

avatar
 9 Sep 2010 2:28 PM
 18 Jul 2006
Dazed
Postaholic
8,516
Me, too. That's why I didn't start a post. Leading to the deaths of people is unfathomable. Thinking it's acceptable to burn any books, let alone holy books (and I am ADAMANTLY not religious), is loathsome.

I hope someone crashes the party with sprinklers and buckets of water and water bombs and fire extinguishers for the fire (and the crowd, I suppose by default---wet t-shirt contest, anyone?). And by someone, I really mean regular citizens. We should stand up for each other and stand up to hatred. We shouldn't be relying on the government, police, judges, or armed forces to do this. Keep them from getting to their burn site, if possible, by just being in the way. Put out fires that do get going. Be a sack of potatoes on the books and dare them to burn you to death. And make sure you invite all the media---not just the people that have been pre-arranged by the idiots.

I will grant everyone and anyone that going this far is probably not practical or safe. But I really, really wish something like it would happen---that people would stand up to the bullies who are spreading hate and terrorizing people throughout the world, even when they're home-grown like this dufus.

avatar
 9 Sep 2010 2:29 PM
 23 Feb 2006
 Calgary
luinge
Postaholic
5,542
Ya I am baffled by this, how can this guy get away with this?

Wouldn't his God be pretty mad at him for just creating more hate? He should be punished by the law for committing a hate crime if he actually does this. Its just wrong on so many levels.

avatar
 9 Sep 2010 2:31 PM
 13 Aug 2002
 Toronto
FriendsFirst
Queen of the Forum
28,628
Mrs_Saucy... yes, there's definitely a double-insult (as if the first wasn't bad enough) by doing this at Eid, too.

He's increasing the risk to the lives of countless people in the U.S., U.S. Associated nations, and deployed (or otherwise a westerner in) Afghanistan & other nations with cells of extremists just looking for an excuse (even a flimsy one... and this is anything but flimsy) frown

avatar
 9 Sep 2010 2:35 PM
 12 Oct 2006
1luckygirl
Addict
4,415
All I am saying is that IF he goes ahead with it, people will not ignore him.

He's going to be stirring up a lot of shi*t, that doesn't need to be stirred up!

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 9 Sep 2010 2:37 PM
 6 Nov 2006
 an Empire State of mind
Kymmie
WB Addict
4,135
As a person who was personally touched by the 9/11 attacks I would love to kick that dude in the @ss with a pointy toed shoe. It shocks me that people could be so ignorant.

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 9 Sep 2010 2:48 PM
 22 Sep 2004
 In the Land of Misfit Toys
evil.mena
Raving Lunatic
14,430
Absolutely not in agreement.

BUT, would this even be a story, cause the 'sh!t' to be disturbed as it were, if the media weren't all over it? If no one knew, it wouldn't have the same effect. I think media needs to takes some responbility of any fallout. But hey, ratings are the king right? *eyeroll*

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 9 Sep 2010 2:50 PM
 21 Jul 2006
Rain_City_Girl
Guru
17,359
I am still speechless over this. The ignorance & intolerance puts me at a loss for words.

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 9 Sep 2010 3:04 PM
 22 Sep 2004
 In the Land of Misfit Toys
evil.mena
Raving Lunatic
14,430
But is it news? And does the media have a responsibility in reporting this drivel? What gets accomplished by publishing it - other than setting off a sh!t storm. Don't give this guy any audience and his message disappears fast...instead, he's infamous worldwide...didn't have to happen.

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 9 Sep 2010 3:21 PM
 8 Jun 2009
Siiera
Postaholic
7,579
I can't believe one looney and his crazy sheep are getting this much attention and how this one person's actions will reflect on all of us.

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 9 Sep 2010 3:27 PM
 26 Nov 2009
MAWL
Addict
4,547
I heard on the news this am he was not actually going to do it, he just wanted to get his point across. GURRR

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 9 Sep 2010 3:33 PM
 12 Oct 2006
1luckygirl
Addict
4,415
YEAH! I read Korean too.
LOL

*must make another coffee*

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 9 Sep 2010 3:35 PM
 24 Sep 2008
PrairieWinter
Postaholic
5,573
Kokopolo--Megalomaniac is the perfect word for him.

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 9 Sep 2010 4:46 PM
 14 Jul 2009
 Ottawa
BandAidChik
Postaholic
9,318
Evilmena - I apologize if I tried to oversimplify your statement.

While I agree that the 24/7 media culture can provide a podium for weirdos and crazies to espouse their beliefs to a very wide audience and that it can lead to negative consequences I don't think we can blame the media for those consequences or expect them to ignore stories like this to avoid potential fallout.

I would rather live in a world where all opinions are shared widely and people like me and you can make decisions on what we think matters and makes sense and what is irrelevant and insane.

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 9 Sep 2010 4:51 PM
 1 Sep 2008
Urban
Postaholic
9,536
I agree with you Evilmena. This guy is a sociopath who is doing this to become famous...or infamous and the media is helping him accomplish that. I totally get what you're saying. It's not about living in a bubble without world news, it's about not giving guys like this their day in the spotlight.

Why is this ok? why is he not going to be arrested?

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 9 Sep 2010 4:56 PM
 18 Jul 2006
Dazed
Postaholic
8,516
I think most of what we call hate crimes in Canada is covered by freedom of speech in the United States. They're still very, very scared of the British, you see, and therefore get to say what they want while being armed to the teeth. ;-) Seriously, though, I think there is a distinction between hate crimes and freedom of speech but it's definitely different north and south of the border, for various historical and cultural reasons.

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 9 Sep 2010 4:57 PM
 14 Jul 2010
TheCatsMeow
WB Chatterbox
328
So this dolt-head guy Pastor Jones says " I have had contact with the Imam in NYC and he has agreed to move the mosque near Ground Zero and we are cancelling our event on Saturday and I will be going to see him in NYC."

live on CBC Newsworld right now.

Really?? "They" are going to move the Islamic cultural centre over this?

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 9 Sep 2010 5:13 PM
 12 May 2008
 Wisconsin, USA
ruby_wi
Raving Lunatic
14,221
Ah jeez...now he says he will cancel the burning if they don't build the Mosque near Ground Zero...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39074573/ns/politics-white_house/

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 9 Sep 2010 6:11 PM
 1 Sep 2008
Urban
Postaholic
9,536
Fighting hatred with more hatred makes perfect sense doesn't it?

crazy

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 9 Sep 2010 6:35 PM
 26 Apr 2010
finallythebride
WB Devotee
2,278
this is HORRIBLE.. as a person who worked hand and hand with the military for years and nearly went over to afghan myself. this irks me to no END...
i have a friend over there now & another one who did 2 tours of duty..

As if they eed a bigger target on their backs..f skaj gheaklg ds,k hjz.dkjhsl;khjdf;labad

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 9 Sep 2010 8:09 PM
 8 Aug 2008
MooseHead
Raving Lunatic
10,422
*ducking head* I think the whole thing is a big farce. And "farce" is such a weak word for what I feel.

I think the entire terrorism aspect against muslims has been orchestrated by the American government and if I really wanted to be an "alien way out there" I'd say orchestrated by the "New Order Government".

This is an entirely different thread but I do believe this to some extent.

Terrorism is a powerful weapon. It is not all bombs, hostage taking, and glory going up in flames. I believe in Darwinism and "natural selection" and I believe Americans, being the strongest and fittest, at the top of the food chain if you will, are exorcising their manpower as they see fit and as how they should (being as strong as they are).

This is of course completely off topic, completely coming from left field and I absolutely mean no disrespect to ANYONE at all.

ALLLL of it (like and including this article) will be seen in an entirely different light in decades and centuries to come. History in the making.

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 31 Oct 2012 11:59 PM
 30 Apr 2012
 buzzle.ca
buzzle
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 9 Sep 2010 8:23 PM
 5 May 2008
littled625
Devotee
1,884
I think this is all disgusting. I'm not religious in the least bit, but I do believe in being tolerant of other religions. Burning the koran is just promoting hatred against Muslims.

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 9 Sep 2010 10:42 PM
 9 Jul 2005
 Around, SK
LadyAurora
Duchess of the Forum
20,003
Allegedly, this individual has called off the Quran burning.

http://www.voanews.com/english/news/usa/...-102521704.html

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 10 Sep 2010 1:16 AM
 13 Sep 2008
 Devon, AB
Wolfwillow
Devotee
2,082
this is the article they had in the Edmonton Journal:


Burn-a-Qur'an pastor used flock as slaves, says ex-worshipper

The American pastor who has provoked international condemnation for plans to burn 200 copies of the Qur'an has been accused of using his own flock as slave labour in a furniture business.

A former worshipper said he worked 72 hours a week without pay for Terry Jones, who insists he will go ahead with the Qur'an burning to mark the ninth anniversary of the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks.

Jones, pastor of the Dove World Church in Gainesville, Fla., runs an antique and used furniture business with his wife, Sylvia.

While the pastor moves between two homes -- a $300,000 US house in Slidell, La., and a holiday apartment in Tampa, Fla. -- his unpaid workers, motivated by their Christian beliefs, live in low-rent accommodation he owns.

Shane Butcher, who was expelled from the church for disobeying Jones, told the Gainesville Sun newspaper that he worked for the pastor's TS and Company for up 72 hours a week without pay and meals were provided from a "food bank."

Butcher said punishments for disobedience ranged from cleaning the barnacles off Jones's boat in Tampa, to carrying a life-size wooden cross or writing out all of Psalm 119, the longest chapter in the Bible.

"We carried a card that said 'obedience is always blessed,' " he said.

Jennifer and Daniel Engel, a German couple, travelled to Gainesville on special visas hoping to do missionary work but quickly found themselves working in the furniture business.

Jennifer Engel said that when her husband decided to return to Germany, she was instructed by a senior pastor to divorce him. "The church totally ruled our lives, who can I marry, what can I do," she said.

Emma Jones, the pastor's daughter from his first marriage, has described her father's church as a "cult." She said last year, "They used mental violence. They'd say, 'If you're not obedient, God will punish you.' "

Police in Gainesville are braced for violence at Saturday's Qur'an burning after members of Jones' congregation threatened to take guns as a "precaution" against attacks from Muslims.

Wayne and Stephanie Sapp brandished handguns as they warned on Wednesday that they were ready to defend the book burning using force. "We believe strongly this is something God has called us to do," said Wayne Sapp. "We feel lives are in danger whether we do it or we don't do it. With the amount of threats we have received, we are taking precautions."

Jones himself confirmed that he had started wearing a .40-calibre pistol strapped to his hip.

Despite growing global criticism, Jones said, "We are still determined to do it. Instead of us backing down, maybe it's time to stand up. Maybe it's time to send a message to radical Islam."

Gainesville police voiced their concern over the prospect of an armed gathering. "Any time someone is carrying a firearm, even though it is permitted, it is a concern to us," said Cpl. Charon Senn, a spokesman.

Hillary Clinton, the U.S. secretary of state, added her voice to the condemnation, describing the burning as a "disrespectful, disgraceful act". The Vatican said it was "an outrageous and grave gesture against a book considered sacred by a religious community".

Afghan police have been placed on alert for the weekend after General David Petraeus, the U.S. commander in Afghanistan, said earlier this week that the book burning would endanger the lives of American troops fighting the Taliban.
� Copyright (c) The Edmonton Journal


Read more: http://www.edmontonjournal.com/life/Burn...l#ixzz0z6JTJ0EC

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 10 Sep 2010 10:39 AM
 13 Aug 2002
 Toronto
FriendsFirst
Queen of the Forum
28,628
[Tangent]

radio host this morning: It drives me nuts the amount of press this is getting....

followed immediately by a complete synopsis of the situation and her additional commentary on it.

you know what? If it drives you nuts how much 'press' it's getting, don't give it even more by taking out of the newscast venue and additionally commenting on it, maybe? wink

[/tangent]

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 10 Sep 2010 11:04 AM
 14 Jan 2009
Mariposa_10
Postaholic
5,310
Okay so I guess I'm going to get myself in trouble here, but this whole thing has been bothering me, and this is as good a venue as any to state my opinion.

I don't know the law on whether this constitutes a legal hate crime, I'm guessing it doesn't or he would have been threatened with prosecution already.

I just wonder. If somebody - a religious leader even - said they were going to stage a Bible burning on the anniversary of - well what - the Salem witch hunt, the Inquisition, Christmas, pick the anniversay of your choice - would it garner nearly this much attention? Sure people would call it wrong, and some people would be upset by the "hate" it embodied.

But all this - Panic - do I dare call it panic? News releases every hour, the President making a personal plea, everyone crying out for it to be halted. Isn't this panic primarily because we are all afraid of the "fallout". We are afraid of how the muslim extremeists will interpret it. We are afraid that it will make American and Canadian soldiers into targets. We are even afraid of retaliatory attacks on civilian type targets. But here's the point WE ARE AFRAID!! It's sick. It's sick that we have come to this place where we are so afraid of Muslim extremists that everyone panics when they think the Muslim world may take offense to something. Isn't that the essence of what's going on here.

If I was a Muslim extremist I would be quite pleased with the sheer terror that is unleashed at the mere mention of my name. That an entire population panics at the thought that someone might piss me off and gain my ire. Mwhahhahahah. The power!

This is what sickens me. Terrorism clearly works.

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 10 Sep 2010 11:50 AM
 18 Jul 2006
Dazed
Postaholic
8,516
Great response, WantOneToo.

Mariposa_10: The US doesn't have hate crime laws the way Canadians do. They do have some sort of laws (libel, slander, etc.) but their prime rule, as it is, is freedom of speech. We don't have freedom of speech here (at least, not like they have in the States), and all told, I think it's a pretty significant difference.

Aside from that, yes, I think people would be just as angry at someone burning the Bible for the same reason on a similar day. I think there would be pleas, but I also think there'd probably be more people who would be calling for the police and/or armed forces to step in and stop it. If I were to burn the Bible to heat my home, probably no one would care. Just like if this guy were to burn the Koran for that reason, too. So, the reaction would be "reason-dependent" but ultimately if the reason is similar, I think it'd be nearly identical, and possibly more extreme.

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 10 Sep 2010 12:30 PM
 18 Jul 2006
Dazed
Postaholic
8,516
It's about information control, though. I think that if the Taliban doesn't even have to make up the "evil deeds" Americans apparently doing, we're going to lose that very, very important fight.

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 10 Sep 2010 12:37 PM
 19 Oct 2009
 Winnipeg, MB
justagirl
Postaholic
6,643
ya, its just such a frustrating situation - vicious cycle for sure!!

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 10 Sep 2010 3:03 PM
 4 Dec 2005
newyears
Addict
4,396
Unfortunately, this is obviously news. This "pastor" is on the front of every major newspaper in my office. I would be angry if I heard that someone said they were going to burn a bible (as I would be if they said they were going to burn any book of religious importance) but not sure I'd react this way:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/11/world/asia/11afghan.html?_r=1&hp


I really appreciate Obama's quote in this article where he talks about having an obligation to protect American's oversees, basically saying he had to intervene because you don't play games with peoples' lives.

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/with+Muslim+faith/3506553/story.html

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 31 Oct 2012 11:59 PM
 30 Apr 2012
 buzzle.ca
buzzle
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